::The Divine Message of the Metaphysical Jesus ::

[Vicutus]

::The Divine Message of the Metaphysical Jesus ::

By: Rev. Vicutus, Dominus de Ordo Sekhemu

William Shakespeare posed a very good question: “To be or not to be?” The answer is to be, meaning to Live! There is but one purpose for our existence, and that is that we are in constant lesson for the mere goal of raising the vibration level. Through our incarnations, we also elevate the Earth’s consciousness through the passing of time.

Perhaps one of the most influential figures of all time was Jesus of Nazareth. To the Metaphysician, Jesus was the highest Ascended Master to visit our planet. His primary teachings are strongly based on love. To a human being, the ‘love energy’ is meshed with personal feeling. Beyond the Veil of Life, the love energy is more than a feeling, it is a creative power source! The Love Source is singular and unique to all, and is the Universal Promise as we are each co-creators on Earth. Christ never said: “I cured thee.” Instead he said: “Thy faith has made thee whole.” The Power is within and available for all!

The visitation of Christ, as well as other Christ-like persons, serves a special purpose. The Master Teachers bring healing and balance to the planet by shifting the population’s consciousness. This transmutation was easily applied through prayer, which is verbally specific, literal, and appropriate for our human Minds. We have learned that through the verbalizing of our thoughts, the intent becomes manifest. This is true when the intent is sincere towards fulfilling our Universal Contract.

Powerful authorities have translated and interpreted the teachings of Christ to subject the common people. Past spiritual leaders would attrition the weaker minds for their ruling benefit. Humans are mentally scarred to believe that they are “born into sin” and that all “fall short of the glory of God.” People are raised to believe that eternal judgment waits after death, and the maleficent will suffer in a Lake of Fire while the blessed are saved in a Heavenly Kingdom.

This is simply not true. We are all born into Beauty. It’s what one does with their life in the long run that blemishes the Spirit. Everything you do is by choice. Choice and the Will to carry out is humanity’s most powerful tool. Nothing is left to chance. There is much truth in the age-old saying: “God doesn’t play dice.” All things happen for a reason. No one falls short of God’s glory, only of the Gnosis and Enlightenment.

Powerful men have written that the wages of sin is death. What ought to be expressed is that living in spiritual ignorance without acknowledging the Love-Energy at the time of one’s death is to die without Enlightenment. Christ came to teach about the immense power of Love so that everyone could apply the type of miracles he performed.

When Christ said: “No man cometh unto my Father, but by me” he meant that no one becomes enlightened without the teachings of the Love-Energy as taught by Jesus. By raising our Minds to the level of the Christ Consciousness, we enhance our opportunity of returning to the [Father] Source.

To a Metaphysician, the concept of God is a unified collective consciousness – the I AM. All beliefs are respected and systems of magick are studied and applied at will. No School of Thought is made wrong. With Ordo Sekhemu, the philosophy of Nehas-t is to Awaken the Shepard within each of us! We are all called to Service, some to teach and guide those in need until they are ready to do the Work independently or with minimal guidance. Others are called to be healers by healing the soul with song and dance, art, and laughter.

Christ was a very effective healer and was perhaps closer to the Divine than any other being in the universe. In saying so, the Christ Consciousness has probably visited other worlds (Planes of existence) probably in the form recognized and understood by those inhabitants. Each Plane vibrates at different frequencies.

What may be the hardest concept for most modern Christians to grasp is the working process of the Trinity. Jesus is not God anymore than you or I. The Holy Spirit is not God. Only God is God. Man’s doctrine embraces the Trinity, which is composed of distinct and separate Entities working as a collective. Its process is thus, God says: “Let there Light!” The Son brings forth the Light, and the Holy Spirit makes the Light visible. We are all children of God, and we are all called to Service to bring forth the Light. The Holy Spirit is the Divine within you and is in direct contact with the Creator. Seek and ye shall find. Look Within – Know Thyself!

The process of the Trinity remains true even to the Metaphysician who interprets the hidden meaning of Light as ‘Wisdom’ (Divine Knowledge). This is applied to the basic foundation of Christ’s message. For Wisdom is of God and love is the most powerful force in the universe. Love is the Universal Promise of which we are to fulfill our Universal Contract in order to attain enlightenment. Hence, to the Metaphysician, the Creator says: “Let there be Wisdom!” The teachings of Love bring forth the Light of Wisdom, and the Higher Self makes the Wisdom comprehensible.

The Love-Energy message caused a significant shift in man’s consciousness on a global scale. The death of Christ upon the Roman Cross sent a trembling ripple through many Planes. It was a very significant universal shift that ended a cycle of man-made laws and dawned a new Aeon based on Love. The intent of this article is not to defame Christian belief or the perception of the Biblical Jesus, but to separate the message of Jesus from the doctrine of man. It is a strong belief that Jesus didn’t come into the world to be worshipped as a god, nor did Jesus expect to be worshipped as God. His visitation was necessary for the Mid-East and the timing was critical for humanity as we shifted from the Age of Law (Moses) to that of Love (Christ Consciousness). Now humanity has ushered in a new era of spiritual liberation. The Divine Message is embraced!

Nehas-t!


© 2000 Ordo Sekhemu.

[Pastor Dirk]

well that was load of crap!

[Camazotz]

Pastor... please refrain from putting down the work of another member, remembering our spirit here at Nox of healthy (but polite) debate. I'd be interested to hear why you disagree with this article, rather than that you have just dismissed it.

Vicutus, thank you for posting this. I found it a very interesting read, though perhaps others find it to be more polemical than I have. I have long struggled myself to seperate the "faith" from the "institution" when it comes to religion. My own belief is that there is one thing, one greater being/consciousness/source/purpose which we all strive to commune with and make ourselves a part of. Some would find my spiritual beliefs to be highly contradictory to their own, for me they just make perfect sense, being a mixture of the things that I was raised with, that I have learned of and experienced as real tangible forces, in both this life and others.

Cama

[Pastor Dirk]

::The Divine Message of the Metaphysical Jesus ::

By: Rev. Vicutus, Dominus de Ordo Sekhemu

William Shakespeare posed a very good question: “To be or not to be?” The answer is to be, meaning to Live! There is but one purpose for our existence, and that is that we are in constant lesson for the mere goal of raising the vibration level. Through our incarnations, we also elevate the Earth’s consciousness through the passing of time.

Perhaps one of the most influential figures of all time was Jesus of Nazareth. To the Metaphysician, Jesus was the highest Ascended Master to visit our planet. His primary teachings are strongly based on love. To a human being, the ‘love energy’ is meshed with personal feeling. Beyond the Veil of Life, the love energy is more than a feeling, it is a creative power source! The Love Source is singular and unique to all, and is the Universal Promise as we are each co-creators on Earth. Christ never said: “I cured thee.” Instead he said: “Thy faith has made thee whole.” The Power is within and available for all!

The visitation of Christ, as well as other Christ-like persons, serves a special purpose. The Master Teachers bring healing and balance to the planet by shifting the population’s consciousness. This transmutation was easily applied through prayer, which is verbally specific, literal, and appropriate for our human Minds. We have learned that through the verbalizing of our thoughts, the intent becomes manifest. This is true when the intent is sincere towards fulfilling our Universal Contract.

Powerful authorities have translated and interpreted the teachings of Christ to subject the common people. Past spiritual leaders would attrition the weaker minds for their ruling benefit. Humans are mentally scarred to believe that they are “born into sin” and that all “fall short of the glory of God.” People are raised to believe that eternal judgment waits after death, and the maleficent will suffer in a Lake of Fire while the blessed are saved in a Heavenly Kingdom.

This is simply not true. We are all born into Beauty. It’s what one does with their life in the long run that blemishes the Spirit. Everything you do is by choice. Choice and the Will to carry out is humanity’s most powerful tool. Nothing is left to chance. There is much truth in the age-old saying: “God doesn’t play dice.” All things happen for a reason. No one falls short of God’s glory, only of the Gnosis and Enlightenment.




© 2000 Ordo Sekhemu.


first let me say, Camazota is right, I should say why I feel the way I do.

so you are saying that there is no judgement for what we do in this life? There has to be judgement or it is ok for the world to act like hitler, sadaam, etc.. No matter what God you beleive in they all come to saying we will be judge for the way we act in this world. either thru hell or heaven or reincarnation.

and yes we all fall short of the glory of God....again no matter what religion (well a cple out there aka:mormans) we all are not Gods or we will never be capiable of being one for we are not Gods....


ok....got to go to work, I am late...I will return to finish what I started

[Preist]

through ancient egypt as an example it wasent the crimes you commited that sent you to hell it was the weight of sin you carried on your heart that was weighed and then judged if you felt no regret then the heart was lighter as they felt justified in what they had done ok its not a pritty piture to think about that if people like sadam are not feeling that they done wrong they wont go to hell

If we are then always judged who would be judged for putting sadam into power a known assasin then what are the varing degrees of being judged upon will some one be judged will you be judged for killing a person who was trying to kill you or a loved one after all it is still murder or someone who has been found guilty of murder do they spend a life time in incarsaration to be brought to judgment and then spend eternity in hell after serving there alocated time for there crimes only examples

and who has the right to judge me i am responsible for my own actions in life no matter what the consiqenses are

it might a point to think about that the institution were it be protestand or chatholic mormon or what ever has shaped the people consepts to have a ruling hand and i dont say this just to christianity but all organised religion

Preist

[RevDevon]

Split thread ...thread also appears in beginnings ..occult/metaphysical ... so as not to be overlooked by those interested and scans new threads there

[Preist]

Thanks for that Rev also trying to work on a few new threads for the section

Preist

[Pastor Dirk]

::The Divine Message of the Metaphysical Jesus ::

By: Rev. Vicutus, Dominus de Ordo Sekhemu

William Shakespeare posed a very good question: “To be or not to be?” The answer is to be, meaning to Live! There is but one purpose for our existence, and that is that we are in constant lesson for the mere goal of raising the vibration level. Through our incarnations, we also elevate the Earth’s consciousness through the passing of time.

Perhaps one of the most influential figures of all time was Jesus of Nazareth. To the Metaphysician, Jesus was the highest Ascended Master to visit our planet. His primary teachings are strongly based on love. To a human being, the ‘love energy’ is meshed with personal feeling. Beyond the Veil of Life, the love energy is more than a feeling, it is a creative power source! The Love Source is singular and unique to all, and is the Universal Promise as we are each co-creators on Earth. Christ never said: “I cured thee.” Instead he said: “Thy faith has made thee whole.” The Power is within and available for all!

.

yes love is a strong thing but to say love will cure you of cancer or make the blind see or make the lame walk is power from inside you is not true, when he said your faith has healed you he was talking their faith in him, when the old lady reached thru the crowd and just touch the helm of his cloths she was healed becaused she "beleived" that Jesus was the God.

[/QUOTE] Powerful men have written that the wages of sin is death. What ought to be expressed is that living in spiritual ignorance without acknowledging the Love-Energy at the time of one’s death is to die without Enlightenment. Christ came to teach about the immense power of Love so that everyone could apply the type of miracles he performed. [/QUOTE]

wages of sin is death but not in the physical way but they seperate you from God. But by praying for forgivness you can be back in the commune with God but thru death of Jesus on the cross our sins are forgiving.
and the type of immense power of love Jesus wanted all of us to have was to love one and another like he loved everyone...kinda like we have here on Nox. there are a lot of differant beleifs but we all love and respect each other.

[/QUOTE] Christ was a very effective healer and was perhaps closer to the Divine than any other being in the universe. [/QUOTE]


I would say raising Lazarus from the dead qualifies him as effective healer


[/QUOTE] What may be the hardest concept for most modern Christians to grasp is the working process of the Trinity. Jesus is not God anymore than you or I. The Holy Spirit is not God. Only God is God. Man’s doctrine embraces the Trinity, which is composed of distinct and separate Entities working as a collective. Its process is thus, God says: “Let there Light!” The Son brings forth the Light, and the Holy Spirit makes the Light visible. We are all children of God, and we are all called to Service to bring forth the Light. The Holy Spirit is the Divine within you and is in direct contact with the Creator. Seek and ye shall find. Look Within – Know Thyself! [/QUOTE]

Well the best way I can explain the trinty to a none beleiver is water. water out of the faucet is water...water in your freezer is still water....water super heated to 280+ degrees turns to a vapor (steam) yet it is still water...

Mahommad never claimed to be God, Budda never claimed to be God...only Jesus claimed to God

I didnt post actual bible verses for I didnt want to sound to prechy....~!

[RKCoon]

Hrrrmm. I have to say, it was an interesting read indeed, though i find such wordings personally distasteful. Personally, i find the idea that we all started out as one being, or rather one group mind, and will end up the same way, utterly horrifying --- i very much prefer to KEEP my individuality. as far a who/what jesus was, i was not there, or if i was i sure dont remember it, so i cant say in any direction about him -- aside of the fact that, what i can judge from what ive seen of history, the guy got screwed by the locals.

Now, Pastor Dirk, this is mostly related to this topic, im going to say this -- At the core of my own personal beleif system, it being at least somewhat based in Luciferian/Satanic, is the simple thought: Thru growth, learning, development, and the human spirit, i CAN learn to become equal to, and then surpass, anything i wish. Shorter - I can become better than god, if i want and need to. Im currently not, ill be the first to admit it -- but i love to cut people down on this, when they say that we can never be equal to god, then in the same breath say that, essentially, god either decided not to control us, or jut plan CANNOT, and from my admittedly limited research into "Christian based" faiths, i find the latter to be more the case. thru our spirit, human or otherwise, ourt drive to learn, to grow, to explore, to better ourselves, we have, we DO currently, and will continue to do things that, even fifty years ago was considered to be godlike powers. we CAN make "true" virgins have children, we CAN "touch the stars", and in some ways we CAN even raise the dead, be it by cloning or cases where the body is clinicly dead for short times and brought back thru various means. It seems to me, if we are to take the "current" version of the bible as accurate, that we ARE gaining on what "god" has -- simply by refusing to be as sheep in the heard. i would also venture to say that if we do assume that god exists -- he/she/it/they might be getting more and more nervous by what we are learning. perhaps he may not like the idea of being.... told his services arent required anymore?

I will throw in here that how we live now, here and now, does effect us later, both in this life, and whatever the next life may be.

[Vicutus]

>>>so you are saying that there is no judgement for what we do in this life? There has to be judgement or it is ok for the world to act like hitler, sadaam, etc.. No matter what God you beleive in they all come to saying we will be judge for the way we act in this world. either thru hell or heaven or reincarnation.<<<

Good point taken into consideration. Society is governed by systems of law that are in place for all to follow. Law applies to everyone in every system of some type. We create our own condemnation as well as our own blessings that affect those around us. Everyone is 'judged'; if not by a Higher Power, then surely my those around us. For example: He judges her, the U.S. judges Germany, etc.

What we do in this life sets the tone for the next. This is judgment is in its most subtle spiritual form - the reincarnation. We return each time to the earth to fulfill our spiritual obligation as many times necessary to become Masters of Life.

One should keep in mind that Christ did not come to start a 'new' religion, he came to reform Judaism. Judaism is a branch of Islam. So there are similarities to their customs, e.g.: man is head of the household.

Personally, I do not believe in the Christian version of their biblical Heaven and Hell. Such graphic representations are said to keep morality out of fear of the unknown. 'Hell' is what we make of it, and one returns to earthly living to improve upon themselves. Hell is not a place, but a condition by which one suffers spiritually - it is separation from the Divine. Salvation is a process involving a Spiritual Awakening (known in Hindu circles as Nirvana and Transcendence, to the Buddhist as Enlightenment, and to the Ancient Egyptians as Nehas-t). When one becomes a Master of Life, then that person returns to the Source ('heaven') and by choice becomes a Guide (commonly misperceived in Islam, Judaism, and Christianity as Angels) to those living upon the world(s).

Rev. Vicutus

[Vicutus]

[/QUOTE] I would say raising Lazarus from the dead qualifies him as effective healer. [/QUOTE]

During the reign of King James in 1611 AD, English scholars "translated" works from the Douay (1610), the Bishops (1568), the Geneva (1560), and other works that directly came from the Vulgate (400 AD), and other Ancient copies, and Early copies called the Codex Alexandrinus (425 AD), Codex Vaticanus (340 AD), and Codex Sinaiticus (330 AD), which ultimately came from the Original Manuscripts (1500 BC - 100 AD). The Original Manuscripts are totally different from the Dead Sea Scrolls and Newly Discovered Manuscripts.

One factor that scholars did not take into account is an understanding of Jewish customs, traditions, and expressions. They translated works, giving a literal meaning rather than interpreting the context of the message.

For example:
The Jewish expression of "turning water into wine" means to bring life into the party.

Its is customary that the 'washing of a man's feet' is something only a wife does to her husband.

In spiritual & Gnostic sects it was important that they spoke in parables to conceal any of the secrets of their group. The "World of the Living" refers to the Inner Circle of that group; whereas the "World of the Dead" refers to the mundanes or Outer Circle. Lazarus, being a disciple of Yehoshua ben Joseph (aka Jesus Christ) demitted from the group; thus placing him amongst the 'dead'. Struck in grief and feeling dis-associated, Jesus went to 'raise him' (an expression known to the Ancient Egyptian mystery schools as Twn-f, and still practiced today amongst Masonic Lodges when one is 'raised' from his figurative death to a Master Mason by the Worshipful Master of that Lodge).

The "New Jerusalem" is not literally a temple floating over Israel as modern day hell-fire preachers like to believe. It is the dawning of a new cycle when the planetary grids begin to shift.

The "Second Coming" of Christ refers to the movement to higher levels of the Christ Consciousness upon the planet.

The description of the New Jerusalem by John the Apostle, its dimensions of the city, the foundation of the walls, the pearly gates, the lights of the city, the stones and emeralds... all correspond to the Tree of Life and the Chakra systems.

The Kingdom of Heaven is not an edifice, but a Temple in YOU.

There is sooo much more, but I hope this is enough.

Rev. Vicutus

[RKCoon]

It does get the point across -- if i interpret your meaning right, thier original versions and meanings of thier "biblical events" were too mild and tame to really attract -- or control -- the masses, so the churches felt things needed to be...spiced up, in order to cow the masses. would i be off in that thought?

[Pastor Dirk]

I would say raising Lazarus from the dead qualifies him as effective healer.

During the reign of King James in 1611 AD, English scholars "translated" works from the Douay (1610), the Bishops (1568), the Geneva (1560), and other works that directly came from the Vulgate (400 AD), and other Ancient copies, and Early copies called the Codex Alexandrinus (425 AD), Codex Vaticanus (340 AD), and Codex Sinaiticus (330 AD), which ultimately came from the Original Manuscripts (1500 BC - 100 AD). The Original Manuscripts are totally different from the Dead Sea Scrolls and Newly Discovered Manuscripts.


Rev. Vicutus[/QUOTE]

well heres the tex from the greek bilble that you said was not really translated the way it should have been....I even help you out by putting it in english letters for you...didnt feel like re up loading the software, havnt used since my siminary days. You will find that it translates the same. this was copied word for word from my greek bible...yes it is written in greek and not english...so I hope all my spelling is correct

hn de tis asqenwn lazaros apo bhqanias ek ths kwmhs marias kai marqas ths adelfhs auths. hn de mariam h aleiyasa ton kurion murw kai ekmaxasa tous podas autou tais qrixin auths hs o adelfos lazaros hsqenei. apesteilan oun ai adelfai pros auton legousai kurie ide on fileis asqenei. akousas de o ihsous eipen auth h asqeneia ouk estin pros qanaton all uper ths doxhs tou qeou ina doxasqh o uios tou qeou di auths
. hgapa de o ihsous thn marqan kai thn adelfhn auths kai ton lazaron. ws oun hkousen oti asqenei tote men emeinen en w hn topw duo hmeras . epeita meta touto legei tois maqhtais agwmen eis thn ioudaian palin. legousin autw oi maqhtai rabbi nun ezhtoun se liqasai oi ioudaioi kai palin upageis ekei. apekriqh ihsous ouci dwdeka wrai eisin ths hmeras ean tis peripath en th hmera ou proskoptei oti to fws tou kosmou toutou blepei. ean de tis peripath en th nukti proskoptei oti to fws ouk estin en autw. tauta eipen kai meta touto legei autois lazaros o filos hmwn kekoimhtai alla poreuomai ina exupnisw auton . eipan oun oi maqhtai autw kurie ei kekoimhtai swqhsetai. eirhkei de o ihsous peri tou qanatou autou ekeinoi de edoxan oti peri ths koimhsews tou upnou legei. tote oun eipen autois o ihsous parrhsia lazaros apeqanen. kai cairw di umas ina pisteushte oti ouk hmhn ekei alla agwmen pros auton. eipen oun qwmas o legomenos didumos tois summaqhtais agwmen kai hmeis ina apoqanwmen met autou. elqwn oun o ihsous euren auton tessaras hdh hmeras econta en tw mnhmeiw. hn de | | h | bhqania eggus twn ierosolumwn ws apo stadiwn dekapente. polloi de ek twn ioudaiwn elhluqeisan pros thn marqan kai mariam ina paramuqhswntai autas peri tou adelfou. h oun marqa ws hkousen oti ihsous ercetai uphnthsen autw mariam de en tw oikw ekaqezeto. eipen oun h marqa pros | | ton | ihsoun kurie ei hs wde ouk an apeqanen o adelfos mou. | | [alla] | kai nun oida oti osa an aithsh ton qeon dwsei soi o qeos. legei auth o ihsous anasthsetai o adelfos sou. legei autw h marqa oida oti anasthsetai en th anastasei en th escath hmera. eipen auth o ihsous egw eimi h anastasis kai h zwh o pisteuwn eis eme kan apoqanh zhsetai. kai pas o zwn kai pisteuwn eis eme ou mh apoqanh eis ton aiwna pisteueis touto. legei autw nai kurie egw pepisteuka oti su ei o cristos o uios tou qeou o eis ton kosmon ercomenos. kai touto eipousa aphlqen kai efwnhsen mariam thn adelfhn auths laqra eipousa o didaskalos parestin kai fwnei se. ekeinh de ws hkousen hgerqh tacu kai hrceto pros auton. oupw de elhluqei o ihsous eis thn kwmhn all hn eti en tw topw opou uphnthsen autw h marqa. oi oun ioudaioi oi ontes met auths en th oikia kai paramuqoumenoi authn idontes thn mariam oti tacews anesth kai exhlqen hkolouqhsan auth doxantes oti upagei eis to mnhmeion ina klaush ekei. h oun mariam ws hlqen opou hn ihsous idousa auton epesen autou pros tous podas legousa autw kurie ei hs wde ouk an mou apeqanen o adelfos. ihsous oun ws eiden authn klaiousan kai tous sunelqontas auth ioudaious klaiontas enebrimhsato tw pneumati kai etaraxen eauton. kai eipen pou teqeikate auton legousin autw kurie ercou kai ide. edakrusen o ihsous. elegon oun oi ioudaioi ide pws efilei auton. tines de ex autwn eipan ouk edunato outos o anoixas tous ofqalmous tou tuflou poihsai ina kai outos mh apoqanh. ihsous oun palin embrimwmenos en eautw ercetai eis to mnhmeion hn de sphlaion kai liqos epekeito ep autw. legei o ihsous arate ton liqon legei autw h adelfh tou teteleuthkotos marqa kurie hdh ozei tetartaios gar estin. legei auth o ihsous ouk eipon soi oti ean pisteushs oyh thn doxan tou qeou. hran oun ton liqon o de ihsous hren tous ofqalmous anw kai eipen pater eucaristw soi oti hkousas mou. egw de hdein oti pantote mou akoueis alla dia ton oclon ton periestwta eipon ina pisteuswsin oti su me apesteilas. kai tauta eipwn fwnh megalh ekraugasen lazare deuro exw. exhlqen o teqnhkws dedemenos tous podas kai tas ceiras keiriais kai h oyis autou soudariw periededeto legei | [o] ihsous autois | autois o ihsous | lusate auton kai afete auton upagein. polloi oun ek twn ioudaiwn oi elqontes pros thn mariam kai qeasamenoi | o | a | epoihsen episteusan eis auton. tines de ex autwn aphlqon pros tous farisaious kai eipan autois a epoihsen ihsous . sunhgagon oun oi arciereis kai oi farisaioi sunedrion kai elegon ti poioumen oti outos o anqrwpos polla poiei shmeia. ean afwmen auton outws pantes pisteusousin eis auton kai eleusontai oi rwmaioi kai arousin hmwn kai ton topon kai to eqnos.eis de tis ex autwn kaiafas arciereus wn tou eniautou ekeinou eipen autois umeis ouk oidate ouden. oude logizesqe oti sumferei umin ina eis anqrwpos apoqanh uper tou laou kai mh olon to eqnos apolhtai. touto de af eautou ouk eipen alla arciereus wn tou eniautou ekeinou eprofhteusen oti emellen ihsous apoqnhskein uper tou eqnous .kai ouc uper tou eqnous monon all ina kai ta tekna tou qeou ta dieskorpismena sunagagh eis en. ap ekeinhs oun ths hmeras ebouleusanto ina apokteinwsin auton. o oun ihsous ouketi parrhsia periepatei en tois ioudaiois alla aphlqen ekeiqen eis thn cwran eggus ths erhmou eis efraim legomenhn polin kakei emeinen meta twn maqhtwn. hn de eggus to pasca twn ioudaiwn kai anebhsan polloi eis ierosoluma ek ths cwras pro tou pasca ina agniswsin eautous. ezhtoun oun ton ihsoun kai elegon met allhlwn en tw ierw esthkotes ti dokei umin oti ou mh elqh eis thn eorthn. dedwkeisan de oi arciereis kai oi farisaioi entolas ina ean tis gnw pou estin mhnush opws piaswsin auton. o oun ihsous pro ex hmerwn tou pasca hlqen eis bhqanian opou hn lazaros on hgeiren ek nekrwn ihsous. epoihsan oun autw deipnon ekei kai h marqa dihkonei o de lazaros eis hn ek twn anakeimenwn sun autw. h oun mariam labousa litran murou nardou pistikhs polutimou hleiyen tous podas | [tou] | tou | ihsou kai exemaxen tais qrixin auths tous podas autou h de oikia eplhrwqh ek ths osmhs tou murou. legei | [de] | de | ioudas o iskariwths eis | | [ek] | twn maqhtwn autou o mellwn auton paradidonai. dia ti touto to muron ouk epraqh triakosiwn dhnariwn kai edoqh ptwcois. eipen de touto ouc oti peri twn ptwcwn emelen autw all oti klepths hn kai to glwssokomon ecwn ta ballomena ebastazen. eipen oun o ihsous afes authn ina eis thn hmeran tou entafiasmou mou thrhsh auto. tous ptwcous gar pantote ecete meq eautwn eme de ou pantote ecete. egnw oun | o | [o] | oclos polus ek twn ioudaiwn* oti ekei estin kai hlqon ou dia ton ihsoun monon all ina kai ton lazaron idwsin on hgeiren ek nekrwn. ebouleusanto de oi arciereis ina kai ton lazaron apokteinwsin. oti polloi di auton uphgon twn ioudaiwn kai episteuon eis ton ihsoun. th epaurion o oclos polus o elqwn eis thn eorthn akousantes oti ercetai | | o | ihsous eis ierosoluma. elabon ta baia twn foinikwn kai exhlqon eis upanthsin autw kai ekraugazon wsanna euloghmenos o ercomenos en onomati kuriou | kai | [kai] | o basileus tou israhl. eurwn de o ihsous onarion ekaqisen ep auto kaqws estin gegrammenon. mh fobou qugathr siwn idou o basileus sou ercetai kaqhmenos epi pwlon onou. tauta ouk egnwsan autou oi maqhtai to prwton all ote edoxasqh ihsous tote emnhsqhsan oti tauta hn ep autw gegrammena kai tauta epoihsan autw.
emarturei oun o oclos o wn met autou ote ton lazaron efwnhsen ek tou mnhmeiou kai hgeiren auton ek nekrwn. dia touto | kai | [kai] | uphnthsen autw o oclos oti hkousan touto auton pepoihkenai to shmeion. oi oun farisaioi eipan pros eautous qewreite oti ouk wfeleite ouden ide o kosmos opisw autou aphlqen[/QUOTE]

[Pastor Dirk]

It does get the point across -- if i interpret your meaning right, thier original versions and meanings of thier "biblical events" were too mild and tame to really attract -- or control -- the masses, so the churches felt things needed to be...spiced up, in order to cow the masses. would i be off in that thought?


King James didnt tweek the bible in that sense but he did change a few things for he didnt like the way they interrupted...ex: instead of many mansions as the KJ says: the greek actually says there are many rooms

[Pastor Dirk]

One factor that scholars did not take into account is an understanding of Jewish customs, traditions, and expressions. They translated works, giving a literal meaning rather than interpreting the context of the message.



Rev. Vicutus[/QUOTE]


well you are wrong there......there mission to translate the bible was to keep it word for word...but you are right on us missing what some of the stuff means...when you read the bible you must remember that "IT IS A EASTERN BOOK" and we have a "WESTERN" mind set

another example...the prodigal son luke 15:11-32 When the father ran out to meet the son....to us that dont mean anything, but in the eastern world a grown man over the age of 16 does not run...it isnt dignfied....

so we do miss a lot of the interpertation of the bible unless (beleivers) we study the word deeply.

[Vicutus]

well you are wrong there......there mission to translate the bible was to keep it word for word...but you are right on us missing what some of the stuff means...when you read the bible you must remember that "IT IS A EASTERN BOOK" and we have a "WESTERN" mind set

I never said that the scholars were wrong in TRANSLATING the Work, because that's exactly what they did from Hebrew into English (Old Testament), and from the Greek into English (New Testament).

I pointed out that the INTERPRETATION is far from the translations, and not to be taken literal.

I am glad we both agree that we (ppl in general) are missing out on the meaning of the books. I think that is probably one of the most enticing mysteries that motivate us to decipher its hidden meanings.

Rev. Vicutus

[Vicutus]

King James didnt tweek the bible in that sense but he did change a few things for he didnt like the way they interrupted...ex: instead of many mansions as the KJ says: the greek actually says there are many rooms

Aye aye, agreed. There are slight differences in the translations as opposed to their original form.

Rev. Vicutus

[Vicutus]

well heres the tex from the greek bilble that you said was not really translated the way it should have been....I even help you out by putting it in english letters for you...didnt feel like re up loading the software, havnt used since my siminary days. You will find that it translates the same. this was copied word for word from my greek bible...yes it is written in greek and not english...so I hope all my spelling is correct


I never said there was anything wrong with the TRANSLATIONS. As a matter of fact this is what I've been saying all along. The scholars translated directly from the Works, rather than INTERPRETING them. A very big difference since many people take what they read LITERALLY, since they have no understanding of symbolism.

Rev. Vicutus

[RKCoon]

Sympolysm is a dangerous thing --- i find that while on one hand, many of the, how shall we say? more extreme of either the left OR the right will say to thier followers that it isnt symbolysm but actual fact, when they are questioned on such by outsiders, or those wanting to be sure, they revert to sayin it was symbolism, not fact. when this happens, it makes me tend to question the legitimacy of what they are preaching about, and what they use for thier base. Not picking on any in paticular here, just tossing it out as food for thought.

[Pastor Dirk]

I never said there was anything wrong with the TRANSLATIONS. As a matter of fact this is what I've been saying all along. The scholars translated directly from the Works, rather than INTERPRETING them. A very big difference since many people take what they read LITERALLY, since they have no understanding of symbolism.

Rev. Vicutus

well thats ALL religions not just christianity.....you MUST understand the author of the writtings and where he is from.....

[Pastor Dirk]

Sympolysm is a dangerous thing --- i find that while on one hand, many of the, how shall we say? more extreme of either the left OR the right will say to thier followers that it isnt symbolysm but actual fact, when they are questioned on such by outsiders, or those wanting to be sure, they revert to sayin it was symbolism, not fact. when this happens, it makes me tend to question the legitimacy of what they are preaching about, and what they use for thier base. Not picking on any in paticular here, just tossing it out as food for thought.


you are right...and I know you have heard me say it before....whatever God you choose to worship do it whole heartedly....if not you will be sifted like the wheat

[Vicutus]

well thats ALL religions not just christianity.....you MUST understand the author of the writtings and where he is from.....

True...very true :)

Rev. Vicutus

[RKCoon]

Yup true indeed. Me tho, i always find it disturbing when one pauses to examine just how literal people take it -- and how much to the extreme such things are taken.